Shirley Williams HPC 21
- This topic has 20 replies, 14 voices, and was last updated 13 years, 7 months ago by .
- Posts
Is anybody on here using HPC 21 clearcoat? We have been having a few issues with it lately and trying to figure out why. The clear is dying back big time after it sits overnite, doesn’t matter if it is over waterbase or solvent, looks like glass when I leave for the day and by the time I get to work in the morning it looks like a mat clear finish. Yes I am letting the base dry totally, tacking between coats and letting sit for 15-20 mins before I clear. We have heat in the booth and let fan run for 10-15 mins after to get overspray out of booth. The boss and I are both stumped on why this is happening. He called Sherwin Willaims today to see if anybody else using that clear is haveing the same problem and all he got was “never heard of that happening before, it must be something that your painter is doing wrong”. Why is it that most reps never think it is their product that is failing? It seems to me that the reps that work for Sherwin in our area are clueless on the products that they sell.
Anybody have any ideas or suggestions that I can try?Thanks
Chris[quote=”csherwood71″ post=20377]Is anybody on here using HPC 21 clearcoat? We have been having a few issues with it lately and trying to figure out why. The clear is dying back big time after it sits overnite, doesn’t matter if it is over waterbase or solvent, looks like glass when I leave for the day and by the time I get to work in the morning it looks like a mat clear finish. Yes I am letting the base dry totally, tacking between coats and letting sit for 15-20 mins before I clear. We have heat in the booth and let fan run for 10-15 mins after to get overspray out of booth. The boss and I are both stumped on why this is happening. He called Sherwin Willaims today to see if anybody else using that clear is haveing the same problem and all he got was “never heard of that happening before, it must be something that your painter is doing wrong”. Why is it that most reps never think it is their product that is failing? It seems to me that the reps that work for Sherwin in our area are clueless on the products that they sell.
Anybody have any ideas or suggestions that I can try?Thanks
Chris[/quote]I have used it a couple of times…similar results. I suggest switching to another brand…:whistle:
If your rep hasn’t heard of the die back, then he isn’t listening.
I am not familiar enough with the product to have a solution, however…
Thanks for the quick reply Ben. I think that we are going to try a different line of clear and see how that works out for us, I am hoping that it is going to be Sikkens products. Our area rep is a complete tool when it comes to products that he is trying to sell/promote. He is just to quick to put it back on us saying that it something we did wrong.
Thanks again.
ChrisI have not used HPC21 but I have sprayed many gallons of HPC15. A few quetions for you. Are you a baking this clear? What temp are you spraying at? Have you had your C.A.H tested? You may try opening the booth door before you leave to let the gasses excape. This clear should not be sprayed in conditions over 90 deg, expecially on horizontal surfaces. What reducer are you putting in it?
I am not baking this clear, just letting it air dry. Using the UH900 hardener and ES 20 reducer. I always open the paint booth doors after it is dust free, and the temperature in the booth stays inbetween 70-80 degrees. Have even put a heat lamp in booth afterwards to keep heat on the area that was painted. Hopefully we can get this figured out soon as it is not good having to wet sand and polish every job.
Thanks
ChrisWe tried to use Martin Senours HPC 15 (I think that is the number) and we had the same results both with the product and paint rep. I gave up fighting the product, I just couldn’t get it to work in my shop and switched to Sikkens and it has realy worked well for us.
Other than buffing every job, you might want to try a different clear from Sherwin that would dry slower and see if that helps your gloss.[quote=”csherwood71″ post=20377]Is anybody on here using HPC 21 clearcoat? We have been having a few issues with it lately and trying to figure out why. The clear is dying back big time after it sits overnite, doesn’t matter if it is over waterbase or solvent, looks like glass when I leave for the day and by the time I get to work in the morning it looks like a mat clear finish. Yes I am letting the base dry totally, tacking between coats and letting sit for 15-20 mins before I clear. We have heat in the booth and let fan run for 10-15 mins after to get overspray out of booth. The boss and I are both stumped on why this is happening. He called Sherwin Willaims today to see if anybody else using that clear is haveing the same problem and all he got was “never heard of that happening before, it must be something that your painter is doing wrong”. Why is it that most reps never think it is their product that is failing? It seems to me that the reps that work for Sherwin in our area are clueless on the products that they sell.
Anybody have any ideas or suggestions that I can try?Thanks
Chris[/quote]
must be something you are doing wrong with it:rofl :rofl :rofl boy have i heard that one b4:chair :chair thats why i quit using there high end clears period that stuff just blows one job will be fine an the next will die like a mother on ya then ya buff the shit outta it ta get it out the door an see the thing 6 weeks later an she is deader than a mutherfuker again try some of there fc 710 an the problem will just flat out dissapear trust me ive been using that stuff for the last 5 yrs an have never had a problem since :cheers :cheersbondo knows……..I have been shooting matrix, omni, and fc clear for the last few years. Sherwin has been the most dependable as far as die back… cant say that its happened once after the gallons and gallons of sherwin clear I have sprayed…..lay it down like you want it to look. :deadhorse
Agreed, makes me questions the competence of the user after having the least problems with sherwin clears. Then its just about confirmed with the topic like “Shirley Williams?”
Thanks for all the replys. We did some calling around yesterday to local shops using Sherwin products and they are all having the same issues with the clear, after we called our rep and he would not return our phone calls. I think that he is finally realizing that he is a complete tool that has no clue about what he is talking about or selling. Sherwin Williams does not care about customer service or technical support.
I painted a roof on a Lexus Thursday and flooded the roof with clear, with no wait time between coats, only to have it die back through the nite with it sitting in the shop with the heat on.
I am happy to say that I have sprayed my last gallon of HPC 21, we are now going to try some other companies clear coat, got some PPG clear in yesterday for me to try on Monday. Hopefully it goes well. If not we will be ordering some Sikkens Superior clear, I know that stuff works well.There is no need to question my competence in spraying, have been painting over 15 years using everything from LIMCO to SIKKENS with excellent results, great shine, laid flat and minimal dust, so if you (sagikun) have nothing to add then keep your comments to yourself. Sherwin Williams is complete garbage.
Chris
And which ppg clear did u get to try?
I’ve gone through a couple of gallons of HPC21 and have to admit it’s better than I thought. I primarily use it for jobs that I have to kick out the same day or spot ins.
I would say the gloss is excellent and stays that way. I find you have to lay it on heavy, which is a little scary because it is very very low viscosity. I normally spray Sikkens compliant clears so HPC21 is way on the other end, thin thin. Somehow HPC21 has good run resistance even though its so thin. Pound this clear on. If you spray far and slow, may not be good clear for you.
Only complaints about it is pretty sensitive clear to fish-eyes. But that’s a cleaning thing. It’s pretty pricey, but if your getting into Superior, then it’s not pricey for you.
I will keep using HPC21, when it’s cost is justified.
Oh, yeah. I would not use this as an everyday clear, two panels max and no top surfaces. Definately a specialty clear.
That’s my two cents.
I dont know how that would work if you are using SW base and planning on using Superior 250 clear…
Superior 250 is supposidly only suppost to be used over top of autowave but who know maybe they just say that lol… Mixing paint manufacturers seems a little risky.5L is on to something here,Sw awx is still a solvent base coat system using a waterborne binder to make it compliant.The only other base coat I would try 250 on would be something based on latex technology like sikkens(ppg enviro base,nexa aqua base plus,Debeer etc)You could do some test panels and throw them out in the elements but that takes time.One other thing to think about is anytime you use a speed clear on a horizontal surface it can die back.Your heatlamp on the area after it is sprayed with no airflow could also be to blame.Just something to think about,hope you get it figured out.
We got a gallon of EC 700 to try out and see if that works. I do know that it is not good to mix different manufactures products and could run into some major problems. We are going to start shopping around with different companys and see whos got the best product and change paint lines entirely. The boss is not very happy with the way Sherwin performs and the fact that the reps will not help us out at all.
gnarly – I do pound this clear on, I put my first coat on like it is my last one, and I also spray close and fast, but not to fast. I like to keep it close and on the verge of puddling up.
Jayson – Thank you for telling me that HPC 21 is a speed clear. I had asked the rep if it was a speed clear and he told me that it was an overall clear. So it took the place of HPC 15?
Thanks
Chris
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.