buzz
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Nice job! Fun driving cars, i had a 93 MX6 that i loved but wanted/couldn’t afford the RX7. Looks like it’s still a good solid car. Now i want one all over again.
[quote=”MetRamos” post=26530][quote=”buzz” post=26527]I own all of the guns you mentioned, and my favorite of them is the WS, but i would have to say that of that group the 3000 is clearly the fastest. Big difference in speed? I wouldn’t say big, but noticeable.[/quote]
O ok, out of the 3000 and 4000 is the finish quality a big difference?[/quote]
I personally prefer the 4000, but it’s all going to come down to your own painting style as any of the guns you mentioned are capable of producing a superb finish when placed in skilled hands.
I own all of the guns you mentioned, and my favorite of them is the WS, but i would have to say that of that group the 3000 is clearly the fastest. Big difference in speed? I wouldn’t say big, but noticeable.
FoMoCo does a rough job on a lot of those, gotta love the customers that always want better than OE. The factory can do it, but don’t you dare. Sometimes people just have to be difficult to be happy.
Anyway, i’ve had excellent luck with Crest Black Jack CB-J2 controlled flow seam sealer and Pliogrip by Valvoline Self Leveling 12 #8010 . I’ve tried most of the better known sealers and i like the results of these the best so far. One thing i did do that makes life so much better on long runs like that is to buy a Cox battery operated dual mix applicator gun #80200. They’re kinda pricey, but worth it, especially once you get the hang of using it.The VHS are the hardeners used in the clears, and i don’t believe you can get them in Standox, i’m pretty sure they’re Spies only. My personal take on them is that they make the clear handle better; they look better both out of gun and out of bake, seem to come out of bake firmer, and to polish a bit easier than with the standard HS hardeners.
Are you using 15-60Plus? If you contact your rep i believe there is an option for activation and reduction with the newer 2.1 products, but i have no experience using them in that clear. Maybe it would work for you. If not the 2.1 PFC clears might be what you need, i have used their Spies counterparts and found them very friendly to use and to have a good appearance.Yep. i’ve had it happen using 15-60 Plus. By chance is that what you’re using? When it was happening to me i was using a 1.4 in my gun, i dropped it to a 1.2 and the problem went away immediately. I found if you over apply that clear it will haze like crazy almost before your eyes. Another option is to do the 1 1/2 coat application method, and it should stop for you. If you’re using 20-30 hardener i’d stick with the 5% reducer and use T25-35 for a little more tail solvent. The hardeners make a difference too. I’m now using the same clear in the Spies line only with the VHS hardener option instead of the standard HS. Much better results. I don’t believe you can get the VHS in the Standox line though.
Yes, the 05-15 is the fast activator, but depending on what you’re spraying, it can still have plenty of open time. I never used the fast dry additive with 15-60 plus, but i do now and then with Spies 8046, so i’m betting it’s the same product, since the clears and activators are. I’ve never had a problem using it. No loss of gloss or pinching. Just stick to the 5% and don’t over add. Essentially what it is is an accelerated reducer, which allows you to decrease your bake temp from 140 to 122 for the same length of time. (15-60 = 15min @ 60 degrees celsius, or 140 fahrenheit substrate temp). If you spray with smaller fluid tips it definitely stays put when you spray it the way you want it to look. If your gun hoses it on, that may be an issue. Also, larger tips on some guns will apply it and give the appearance of fisheyes on your first coat, making it kinda hard to spray it the way you want it to look…these are not fisheyes and go away with the 2nd coat and still a good final appearance. 10 minute flash with slower activator, more like 5-7 with faster ones is plenty for me.
Please post up your thoughts and impressions on the Sagola. I’ve been curious about and know little about them. I’d love to hear what you think of the gun, and of how it sprays the 15-60 plus for you.
Good luck.I’ve used a decent amount of 15-60 plus. Currently using Spies 8046 which is THE same clear… For the 15-60 plus without baking capability i’d start out with the 05-15 for 3 or less panels and 15-25 for bigger jobs. I think you’ll find that the 20-30 is too slow, but if you have really good airflow maybe not. That clear really performs best with a bake, so without it you won’t get the best of it. Still nice, though.
What gun setup are you planning to use? That clear is pretty friendly to different guns and tip sizes. For 2 coat application i like the W400lv 1.2@28-30psi, for 1 1/2 coat i like a 1.3-1.4 in most any gun. Dial in your hardener, add the 5% reducer and spray it the way you want it to look and don’t depend on flow.Did you find your parts yet? I ordered spares and a 1.4 for mine today and they have plenty in stock so you shouldn’t have a problem if you have a jobber that buys direct thru either ASET or Bonding Solutions. I uploaded the pics i said i would of a few things i sprayed with mine this week.
[quote=”Anders” post=25560]I just painted a motorcycle tank with decals on it, but got some nasty runs where the decals are. What’s the best technique to avoid this? Start with a thin tack layer over the decal, wait a couple of minutes, and then a wet coat?[/quote]
You answered your own question. The tack coat will neutralize the surface tension and should eliminate that problem for you in the future. I usually do a tack over the entire substrate getting cleared though, not just the decal.
I can’t comment on the 4000, but i have a 3000RP and WS400 and LS400H guns. The WS speed wise would be more comparable to the 3000RP, but i personally like the atomization of the WS better. But that’s just personal preference. Nothing wrong with the LS400H, but i always preferred my tried and true W400 to it. The WS is just on the next level. The WS has been discontinued for sale in the states,not sure about elsewhere, so if you want one you’d better snag one fast. They’re still easy to find online.
I’ve used tons of the LE clears. I started using the LE5100 last February and sprayed it along with my Spies clears till this past fall. It’s got good gloss and buffs easily, quite user friendly. Looks very OE for collision work. Probably realistically looking at a full 6 hours to dry to really handle and polish without being able to get the panel temp up. The LE5300 has been discontinued, in the states at least, and the LE5400 i don’t find quite as nice. Actually waiting on it to do a quick bake while i type this…it isn’t bad clear, actually looks decent and air dries to handle and polish in about 2 hours, i agree. Wicked fast with a short bake. If you go the 5400 route, larger fluid nozzles are your friend. Dupont recommends 1.4-1.6. Believe it. I’ve done it with a 1.3 and you really need to move in tight and lay it on. I don’t use it on more than 1 medium size or 2 small panels, it’s just too quick.
The newer LE8300 and 8700 clears are nice, but don’t consider them without bake capabilities. If in fact the regs are still at 3.5 consider the HC4700. I used to love that clear when used with the appearance activator, fast air dry too.I’ve sprayed a few jobs with Martin Senour Vortex, don’t use it, but did a relatively in depth demo of it and some other manufacturers waterborne to see how they compared should i ever need or want to switch. Martin Senour and Sherwin i’m sure you know are the same product, just Martin Senour is marketed through NAPA stores. Best advice i could give you regarding spraying their base is don’t overthink it, and don’t worry about it. It isn’t too difficult. it is however a little thinner product i thought, and i’d bet you’ll find you need a bit more gun distance than you’re accustomed to with whatever solvent you spray. I thought it blended ridiculously easy, and it only took me my first panel to figure out how to adjust to spray it, and the 1st car i did was a silver Subaru. I’m sure they’ll show you all the basics before they cut you loose. You’ll be fine. Good luck to you.
We have a Sidewinder. Using PPS and mixing carefully keep wastes to a minimum, so we don’t generate a lot. But the Sidewinder “cooks” about 4 gallon of waste paint in an 8 hour day. You’re left with a bag of solid waste and a can of solvent that’s good for clean rinse at best, but not really worth using to clean guns in my opinion. It is good for use as a quick pre-rinse in a squirt bottle and for cleaning greasy parts. I can recycle Naked Gun cleaning solvent one time with it and have it remain effective, anything more and it loses its pizzazz. If you’re looking at it to cut down your waste paint disposal costs, it’ll take a helluva long time to recoup your investment, but it does work. Mine isn’t a new one, the 1st owner took the hit. :dnc
I could really get going on this one, but at this late hour i’m not going to. 😉 For now all i’ll add is that everyone should be going into their estimating system’s shop profile setup and checking the box for body supplies and charging for them. Right now most shops around here are either $2 or $3 per body hour. Think about it. If you have 8 hours of body labor, and get an additional $24 on your materials bottom line, that’s huge. Not all companies are paying it, but many are. How much flack you get from companies and appraisers is directly dependent on how many other shops in your area are allowing their system to calculate body supplies. If you’re the only shop writing for ’em, you’re gonna get more resistance. The companies squeal like a banshee if shops talk about labor or material rates and there are even anti collusion laws in some places. What do you call what they all do?? Bottom line is read your P pages, memorize as much as you can so that you can engage in well informed debates when the need arises, even print copies of the ones most often needing negotiation, and write for all necessary operations. Don’t overlook the little things. The little things you overlook writing and fighting for affects your materials bottom line, not just your labor.
BTW, nice reply bgiordano, your numbers are spot on with what you hear at estimating and damage analysis seminars.